gateslacker: (SPNcokeandasmile)
[personal profile] gateslacker
Don't get me wrong. I am loving this season. Week to week I am waiting with baited breath to see What. Happens. Next. I'm intrigued with all aspects of the story so far.

There is no weeping and wailing or feeling the need for Sam and Dean to get over it already because they've got over it already too many times in the past without any real forward momentum. I've said it before and I'll say it again that it's one step forward two steps back with the boys and, folks, that is REAL LIFE. We all do this dance in those relationships that mean the most, especially with people most at odds with our own personalities. Sometimes we grow and move forward. Sometimes we back peddle and fall into conditioned responses. I LIKE the exploration, here, and have no desire for events to just be forgotten or swept under the rug. I think this is why I love this show so much. You do see fallout and there is no reset button week to week.

But, for the love of Chuck can we please have both POVs!?! It would have been SO EASY in this episode. We started with the Dean POV in his room. How hard would it have been to end with a Sam POV in his room???  And, yeah, part of this is because, while I can suss out the Sam POV (and not understand why it's so damn hard for other people to do so), I still want to SEE it. And, yeah, part of it is because I want others to see it, too, because, frankly, the backlash is pissing me off.

Seriously!

Now, I'll be the first to say that I understood why Dean did what he did in the series opener. And I am totally cutting and pasting my response in another journal here but, all perceptions of Dean as a character and his motivations aside, as well as the separate, confounding issue regarding supernatural possession, I can understand why he did what he did, initially. This wasn't Cold Oak or even the half season leading to Swan Song where he had time to come to terms with Sam's plan. He only had moments to make the decision. Sam was not physically present to discuss the situation and even if Dean knew that Sam had accepted death, well, that is not the same as wanting to die (despite fandom's apparent confusion in this matter.) He thought (or wanted to believe) that Ezekiel was a good angel. He had Cass's word that Ezekiel was a good angel. For me, Dean's real wrong came when he allowed Ezekiel's blackmail and subterfuge to continue. He chose to ignore all of the red flags that Zeke was not on the up and up. Once Sam was physically aware he should have been allowed to oust or to not oust Ezekiel as he saw fit. Heck, after Lucifer, we know he has it in him to take over.

Although we now know that Gadreel would have probably shut Dean down, Dean didn't really make the effort AT ALL until too little, too later.

However, (and this is a big however) empathy and understanding of an action do not change the inherent rightness or  wrongness of an action.

At the moment, what actually transpired has been overtaken by empathy toward Dean's woobie face and feelings to the point where Sam doesn't even have the right to feel wronged or even call Dean out on his shit!

And I feel bad for Dean. I really do. But I've been doing a bit of a re-watch and Dean has said some pretty hurtful things and called Sam out in the past. But that's okay because, apparently, Dean can say or do anything and be forgiven anything but, for Sam, "what's right is wrong and what's wrong is wrong."

And that really bothers me. I am a bit frustrated because, the more extreme fandom viewpoints aside, all it would take is a more even point of view! I don't want to rely on my perception and ability to suss it out. I WANT to SEE it. I am getting tired of NOT SEEING IT.

It's not without precedent *cough* I know what you did last summer *cough*  but I'm beginning to feel that "First Born" is the only time we are gonna see the Sam POV regarding the events that have transpired. I know folks were clamoring for a Dean mytharc and I am all for that but I had hoped that with Dean driving the story arc for a change we could have Sam driving the emotional arc for a change. I am feeling pessimistic and have a suspicion that Sam is no longer in the vehicle at all.

Date: 2014-03-02 06:08 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] vyperdd.livejournal.com
I totally agree with pretty much everything you've said, esp in regards to the very limited Sam POV we are getting this season (and have in fact gotten for the last few seasons) I wrote in reply to a similar comment by [livejournal.com profile] ash48 in another LJ:

BUT! It hasn't happened yet. In a season Sam usually get 2 episodes of his pov. So far we've had some in 9.01 and an attempt at giving us some with his scenes with Cas - but that's it really (and the Cas ep ended up being more of Cas's pov anyway). I'm hoping they have an entire episode dedicated to Sam's pov before the end of the season (yeah, I know, and pigs might fly).


My reply: This makes me so sad. :-( That, on a 22/23 ep per season show with 2 lead actors playing the 2 main characters, that we would be hoping that Jared and Sam gets an episode or two that focusses on him. That 1 ep a season should make us grateful and excited, when shouldn't we be getting an equal number of eps split between Dean and Sam. When did it become so one-sided and Dean-centric??? It seemed a lot more even back in Seasons 1 & 2. Too often Sam seems like a supporting character (and Jared a supporting actor) on his own show.

I even notice when watching the previouslies, that Sam and his storyline is featured very little and usually at the end after secondary characters like Cas and Kevin and Crowley.


We could have even started the ep with Sam in his room, seeing as we had the next sequence following Sam through the bunker looking for Dean. But yeah, I was really ticked off that we have no idea what Sam did after he closed the door to his room at the end.

For me, Dean's real wrong came when he allowed Ezekiel's blackmail and subterfuge to continue. He chose to ignore all of the red flags that Zeke was not on the up and up. Once Sam was physically aware he should have been allowed to oust or to not oust Ezekiel as he saw fit. Heck, after Lucifer, we know he has it in him to take over.

This is the only part I don't agree with. For me, it was when Dean said and thereby acknowledged "That Sam would never agree to be possessed, that he would rather die" and then went ahead with a plan to have Sam possessed anyways, because as Sam pointed out in "The Purge" : You didn't do it for me. You did it for you, cause you didn't want to be alone." Every decision Dean made after that, manipulating coma!Sam by having Gad appear as Dean, agreeing to Gad wiping Sam's memory over and over, lying to Sam whenever he raised concerns about how he was feeling, missing chunks of times etc was just another wrong that would never have been necessary had he abided by what he knew Sam's choice would be. Death rather than possession.

Date: 2014-03-02 07:47 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gateslacker.livejournal.com
Gah, stupid LJ. I type this reply and then it is lost. But, yeah, it has always been a bit uneven, especially after season 2 when Dean really became the emotional center. Last night I was watching Children Shouldn’t Play with Dead Things because it is an episode that I haven’t re-watched that much and we do get some Sam POV in the cemetery at the beginning of the episode. Following that, the episode is all about Dean and how Dean feels about John’s death, which is understandable given the manner of John’s death. But, because I am relatively new to SPN, I can still remember being frustrated even then that we didn’t get more about how Sam felt about John’s death. The show makes it seem that John meant more to Dean than he does to Sam. We tend to get a few bits of dialogue telling us how Sam feels about stuff but very little in the way of showing us how he feels. This pattern is repeated season after season, supporting character after supporting character, and even with regard to Dean, himself. Is it any wonder that audience perception is “Poor Dean. Sam Sucks?” It would be very easy to conclude that Sam just doesn’t care as much as Dean does or that Sam only cares about himself.

Then it doesn’t help that the show gives us scenes that leave way too much to audience interpretations such as “Sam’s Heaven” or “Why Sam didn’t look for Dean.” So, yeah, the lack of true Sam POV is not new to this season or the current show-runners. But this is a situation where Dean made the Big Mistake and, still, no one cares about what was done TO Sam because Show doesn’t really show us the impact on Sam. It, again, shows us the impact on Dean and pretty much Dean alone. Even Kevin’s death is mostly about how Dean feels about it with Sam being told, “Well, you shouldn’t feel bad. It wasn’t you. It’s all on me. Get over it.” And, sure, it wasn’t Sam’s choice but, FCOL, I am sure it’s Sam that remembers actually killing Kevin!


This is the only part I don't agree with. For me, it was when Dean said and thereby acknowledged "That Sam would never agree to be possessed, that he would rather die"

Yes, and I don’t disagree exactly. But, to me, this is another example of Dean knowing What. Sam. Would. Want. And I don’t quite trust that either. Dean is a very black and white thinker and Sam is not. I can surmise that Sam would not wish to be possessed because all of Sam’s experiences with possession have been negative but I have to think: Would Sam really have disagreed if given the choice of having a “good” angel, or even Castiel, possess him briefly to save his life? I’m not certain. Of course, if Dean really believed this he still knew he was making the wrong decision, something I "got" from him initially that seems to be forgotten now. But, anyway, either choice Dean made would have been a choice Dean was making “for” Sam.

I also agree that Dean did it for Dean but I also feel that Sam, as I perceive him, would have understood that Dean only had moments to make the call especially IF Dean had come clean immediately and explained the situation thereby relinquishing control over Sam’s choices. We also have Sam who is reeling from the end results of Dean’s deception but would he really have chosen to let Dean die all things being equal as it was perceived, initially. I’m not altogether certain that Sam would have really let Dean die if there was a chance of saving him. However, I do think Sam would have come clean immediately and given Dean the choice of how to proceed from there.


But, yo! Dean says at the end of CSPWDT:

“Sam. You and Dad... you're the most important people in my life. And now... I never should have come back, Sam. It wasn't natural. And now look what's come of it. I was dead. And I should have stayed dead. You wanted to know how I was feeling. Well, that's it. So tell me. What could you possibly say to make that all right?”

Seriously!?! Now, what could Dean say to Sam to make it all right? I am sure it’s not “I’d do it again!” Dean is not the injured party here even though he is acting like he is. Even though the show makes it out that he is. And if that's not victim blaming I don't know what is!

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